Interview with CZ: 99% of Memes will eventually fail, and the highest price of BTC in this round of cycle may be between $500,000 and $1 million

Guest: Changpeng Zhao, founder of Binance

Host: Farokh

Podcast source: FAROKH RADIO

Original title: CZ talks Life inside Prison, Trump Presidenty, and state of Crypto!

Broadcast date: May 6, 2025

Summary of key points

In this exclusive interview, Farokh had an in-depth conversation with Binance founder and former CEO Changpeng Zhao, who is well-known as "CZ". They explore CZ's incarceration experience and how he learns from it; his views on Trump's possible second term; and also talk about his overall perception and feelings about the current cryptocurrency industry.

Wonderful view summary

• The highest price of Bitcoin in this cycle may be between $500,000 and $1 million. By the end of the year, the total market capitalization of the cryptocurrency market was approximately $5 trillion.

• Judging from the current trend, the government will only buy Bitcoin more and more, and I hope that ordinary investors can buy Bitcoin before the government.

• I realized that I would never be a Memecoin trader. I'm not a cryptocurrency trader either. I prefer to be a platform builder to build tools for people to use rather than participate in transactions in person.

• Artificial intelligence (AI) is a very important field and I am particularly interested in the field of science. In addition, there are some application areas that are closer to reality, such as RWA (real-world assets), and ETFs are also a very interesting direction.

• An obvious problem in the industry now is the overheating of "Memecoins", and there is too much capital pouring into these Memecoins in the market. In the short term, 99.999% of Memecoins will eventually fail.

• I think the traditional media industry needs to change, otherwise they will be eliminated by the times. Some reports are often not investigating real issues, but with clear personal issues, specifically targeting certain people. This practice not only fails to make a profit, but instead damages the company's reputation.

• I realized that health is the most important thing, followed by family, then work and other things. In prison, you will find that you don’t really miss food. Although you occasionally miss a comfortable bed, what I care about the most is my family.

• In the past, I wasn't sensitive to geopolitics and other issues, but now I realize that these political agendas can directly affect individuals and may even put you in trouble. So, I'm more careful now.

• In the future, decentralized exchanges will be larger than centralized exchanges. We hope to make a lot of investment in these areas.

• Exchanges exist not only for speculators, but while they provide liquidity, it is more important to create a healthy ecological environment for long-term builders.

• I work at least six days a week, sometimes even six and a half days. Even on weekends, I will arrange meetings. Even if I am not working, I always think about work-related things in my mind.

Farokh: Hello everyone, I am Farokh, welcome to Rock Radio. Today 's guest is legendary CZ, the founder of Binance. Thank you very much for taking the time to be interviewed. Do you like life here? I know you have a close relationship with the royal family here. What is it like to live in the desert?

CZ : I live here, so I really like it. Actually, I had the choice to settle almost anywhere in the world, but in the end I chose this place and I thought this country was great. Although Dubai is very prosperous, its traffic is a bit crowded and there are many people, and it is developing very fast. Abu Dhabi, on the other hand, appears quieter and more low-key, but at the same time it is very powerful. I think this is one of the best leadership countries in the world.

Farokh: Today we have a lot of topics to talk about, such as your views on the cryptocurrency industry, Trump’s presidency, Abu Dhabi’s government policies, etc. I originally wanted to talk about encryption legislation, but I thought that part of it was too boring, so I skipped it today. We might talk about your prison experience, comparisons between centralized exchanges and decentralized exchanges, and even talk about Meme Coin. If time allows, we can also talk about Binance. Of course, there is also a prediction game section at the end. Your prediction this year is very accurate, so let’s see what will happen next today.

Will not become a Memecoin trader

Farokh: Have you gained anything during the process of participating in BNB Memecoin?

CZ :

I think this is actually very interesting. Last year I was busy with other things in the United States and missed the entire Memecoin craze. When I got back to this field, everyone was talking about Memecoins, but in fact, many projects weren't really practical.

This process is actually quite interesting, but not easy. At first I thought I just needed to design a picture and publish it, but then I found that there were many rules and etiquettes in the community. For example, many people asked me about my pet's name at that time and asked me to post a photo. I never expected that a photo would trigger so many PvPs.

At first I thought it was just an interesting attempt, so I decided to send a preview first and then officially release it 24 hours later, hoping to create some popularity. Unexpectedly, thousands of "Broccoli" emerged during the release, and there was a debate among the communities.

During this process, I felt that the cultural and community atmosphere of Memecoin was very strong. At the same time, I also learned that being a major trader is not easy. They spend every day in group chats, always paying attention to which new coins will be popular. After all this, I realized that I would never be a Memecoin trader. Actually, I am not a cryptocurrency trader myself. I prefer to be a platform builder to build tools for people to use rather than participate in transactions in person. But no matter what, we always focus on the needs of the community and if the community is interested in Memecoin, we will try our best to support it.

At that time, I was also thinking, "Okay, let's look at the BNB chain and its ecosystem." I started to participate more in this field because everyone hoped that I would spend more time on it, after all, my participation can really bring more attention to it. I also hope to provide some help to the BNBChain ecosystem. Although I cannot directly participate in the transactions of the decentralized exchange (DEX), I have no restrictions on the decentralized BNB ecosystem, etc. So I will devote my time to where I can participate and promote ecological development as much as possible.

Optimistic about AI and Desci

Farokh: What is the part you are most interested in in the industry?

CZ :

In fact, behind the lively discussions in the industry, there are many things worth paying attention to are happening quietly.

First of all, artificial intelligence ( AI ) is a very important field . The combination of artificial intelligence and blockchain has great potential. Blockchain can directly utilize the capabilities of artificial intelligence, and artificial intelligence can also implement more functions on the blockchain.

Secondly, I am particularly interested in the field of science. I think the impact of science will be very far-reaching in the long run. Financing for scientific research has always been a difficult problem because it usually takes a long time to achieve results. This is obviously not attractive enough for investors who are pursuing short-term returns. But I believe that scientific research, especially in the field of biotechnology, will become crucial in the future.

Through cryptocurrencies and smart contracts, we can raise funds for scientific projects and issue funds in phases based on research progress or time nodes. This model can also inspire millions of small research laboratories around the world to participate. Combining the capabilities of big data and artificial intelligence, I believe we will have significant breakthroughs in drug research and development and understanding of human biology. These progress is not only possible, but is actually being gradually realized.

In addition, there are some application areas that are closer to reality, such as RWA (real world assets). Some large traditional companies are exploring this area, such as BlackRock is trying to trade assets through blockchain technology.

Also, ETF is a very interesting direction. It brings funds from traditional financial institutions into the cryptocurrency market. In the United States, institutional investors account for the majority of the inflows, while the situation is slightly different in other regions. We can already see the impact of this trend, such as the recent rise in Bitcoin prices, which is closely related to the promotion of Bitcoin-based ETFs. So, I think there is still a lot of things that are happening in the industry that are worth looking forward to.

Is the institutionalization of cryptocurrencies posing a threat to its

spirit?

Farokh: Are you worried that cryptocurrency development has become so large that it is starting to involve the political sphere? Now even ETFs (exchange-traded funds) appear. Judging from the price trend, the institutionalization of Bitcoin is obviously a positive factor, right? Our assets are rising. Although altcoins are not doing that well, at least the price of Bitcoin is rising. Do you think this institutionalization will pose a threat to the decentralized spirit advocated in the Bitcoin white paper?

CZ :

It does have some impact. Everything has two sides, nothing is completely good or completely bad, so we need to find a balance in it.

As early Bitcoin supporters and decentralized believers, we would like the government to intervene as late as possible, especially when it comes to buying Bitcoin. Many people hope that ordinary investors and ordinary users can own some bitcoins before the government buys on a large scale. Different people will have different opinions on this. Of course, from another perspective, government purchases of Bitcoin will have a positive driving effect on the price, and it can also strengthen people's confidence in Bitcoin. So there are pros and cons of this matter.

Overall, in a decentralized world, we cannot control the behavior of others and control government decisions. The change in the US attitude is a good example. The US government's attitude towards cryptocurrencies was still relatively cold 100 days ago, but now they seem to realize that buying Bitcoin is the right choice. This transformation is good news for the entire industry, but I still hope that ordinary investors can buy before the government.

Farokh: So they still have time, right?

CZ :

Yes, we've been talking about cryptocurrencies and have been working hard to drive it, and they actually have enough time to buy it. If someone doesn't want to buy it, it's their choice.

Farokh: I heard you are still providing advice to some government departments in Pakistan, and Bilabansakhi is also your friend. In addition, Abu Dhabi's sovereign wealth fund has also recently invested in Binance. Judging from the current trend, the government will only buy Bitcoin more and more. This has triggered the domino effect in the United States, and I think it is an important turning point and may even affect decision-making in other countries.

99.99% of Memecoins will eventually fail

Farokh: Over the past cycle, you have had a keen insight into some corruption in the industry, and your intuition about this industry has always been very accurate. So this time, what problems or potential "hidden dangers" do you think exist in the industry? What should we pay special attention to?

CZ :

An obvious problem in the industry now is the overheating of "Memecoins", and there is too much capital pouring into these Memecoins in the market. In the short term, 99.999% of Memecoins will eventually fail. According to statistics, about 13 million tokens are tracked on CoinMarketCap, and you can imagine that most of them will not have a future. This is a high-risk area. Fortunately, most investors in meme coins are well aware of this, because failure cases are so common that they have accepted this fact. But at the same time, this phenomenon has also reduced people's attention to projects that are truly practical.

Developing a compliant crypto project has been very difficult in the past four years, especially during the previous administration. The Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) often sues project parties, claiming that their tokens are securities and so on. Fortunately, some of these lawsuits have been dropped recently. So I believe that more developers will rejoin this industry in the future. While the industry was once forced to grow in a less healthy way, I am now more optimistic about the future because it is moving in the right direction.

Farokh: The SEC does feel stressful, say, they might send you to jail. As founders in the industry, we are always worried about tokenization. Even assets like NFTs were once labeled as securities in Google Labs cases, such as projects like CyberKong, and the charges were finally dropped. Now, I feel as a founder, I have more confidence in taking risks than before, because I feel able to take more risks. After all, we need to maintain a spirit of exploration and risk in this industry, especially in cutting-edge areas like artificial intelligence.

CZ :

That's true. Many excellent American entrepreneurs have chosen to leave the United States, which is not good for the U.S. economy and the U.S. leadership in cryptocurrency and artificial intelligence. However, I did not expect an election to bring such a big policy change, which also illustrates the power of democracy from another perspective.

Traditional media needs to change

Farokh: Recently, the Wall Street Journal and Bloomberg published some articles criticizing the crypto industry, which sparked widespread discussion. What do you think of these reports?

On the way, I saw you tweeting about the Wall Street Journal and citing Elon Musk’s tweets to discuss fake news. Trump often talks about similar topics. Although these reports are not necessarily completely false, they do have obvious negative tendencies. This is one of the reasons why I founded Rug Radio. Later we merged with Decrypt Media because I always thought Decrypt was one of the highest quality media in the crypto space. Our goal is to demonstrate the potential of encryption and emerging technologies as actively as possible. Of course, this doesn’t mean we ignore negative news, but we don’t need to just report negative content. Like the Wall Street Journal and other mainstream media, it seems that we are always reported to us in a negative light as much as possible. Recently, they even made personal attacks on you, such as claiming that you “betrayed” other founders of the crypto industry in prison for a reduction in sentence. What do you think about this?

CZ :

Indeed, traditional media usually pick a target person and focus their firepower on them. They might choose Elon Musk, Trump, or me and others. Around these goals, they will publish a large number of articles with negative tendencies.

But luckily, this method is no longer as effective now. Although traditional governments claim to support freedom of speech, they actually support certain news organizations through funds, indirectly affecting the content of the report. This strategy may have worked in the past, but now it is counterproductive.

For example, the failure of some political parties in elections shows that people's trust in traditional media is weakening. Now social media gives each of us the opportunity to speak out. Through videos, conferences, etc., we can directly interact with the public and show our true self, rather than letting certain articles define us. While these negative reports are still annoying, we at least have our own platform to express our true views. For example, I may have more social media followers than most politicians, and Elon has far more fans than others. With the rise of social media, real voices have become more and more important, so we are less worried about it anymore, but it still feels unpleasant.

Farokh: It's really a headache. Because these reports will affect the outside world's view of us. People inside our industry understand the reality, but people outside tend to share articles from Bloomberg and Wall Street Journal rather than from professional crypto-media reports like Decrypt.

CZ :

I've talked to a Bloomberg executive who mentioned that they're even considering canceling the investigation of the news because these reports are often not investigating real issues, but with clear personal issues, specifically targeting certain people. This practice not only fails to make a profit, but instead damages the company's reputation. Bloomberg is essentially a technology company, not a media company. They mainly make money by selling terminal equipment, and media business is actually a burden to them.

I also heard that more than 30% of Bloomberg's news content is generated by AI, but these are mainly news news, such as market changes, and do not involve investigation and reporting. These news has attracted more attention because it is more objective and data-driven. By contrast, reports with strong subjective tendencies are hurting the company's image. So, I think the media industry needs to change, otherwise they will be eliminated by the times.

Farokh: We are trying to change, too. For example, we use resources like Crypmedia and Rug Radio to capture market sentiment in real time. Just like Polymarket’s performance during the Trump election, there are often significant differences between media coverage and the public’s actual investment behavior.

Tough moments and changes in prison

Farokh: Did your experience in prison have a profound impact on the way you live and work?

CZ :

Of course there is. This kind of experience will always make you rethink your life’s priorities. First, I realized that health is the most important thing, secondly, family, then work and other things.

In prison, you will find that you don’t really miss food. Although you occasionally miss a comfortable bed, what I care about the most is my family. You won't miss money, or work in particular, although it's really a bit sentimental for me to quit as CEO of Binance.

I've always been a builder, so I can't stop. Fortunately, although I am no longer young, I am not too old and still have the energy to do something. Now I focus on helping funds, providing advice to other entrepreneurs, and communicating with them and learning. At the same time, I am also building an education platform. Although still busy, I believe that no matter where you are, you can have a positive impact in different ways.

In addition, this experience made me more cautious. In the past, I wasn 't sensitive to geopolitics and other issues, but now I realize that these political agendas can directly affect individuals and may even put you in trouble. So, I'm more careful now.

After I was released from prison, I spent a while getting used to life. In the first few months, I was rarely active on social media and did not attend any events. After a period of adjustment, I slowly returned to normal.

Farokh: Have you made friends in it?

CZ :

I did keep in touch with a few friends. You can meet good people anywhere. Of course, there are also some people who have been over-punished. They may have made some mistakes, but the punishment is too severe. I still keep in touch with some friends in prison. Their situation is very difficult and there are few lawyers who can help them, especially the fees outside are very high. They also have difficulty getting information because there is no internet in prison and communication can only go through a very backward system and cannot even send pictures or links.

Farokh: Then can you know the price of Bitcoin in prison?

CZ :

Not sure at all. However, someone will ask me how I am doing through messages, and ask me about Bitcoin and Binance Coin (BNB). There are several TVs in the prison, but most of them play sitcoms and sports. I don't watch sports or TV. However, several prisoners were interested in cryptocurrencies, so they opened a financial channel specifically. I saw some news in prison, such as the assassination of the president and the 34 criminal charges Trump faces.

One of the allegations was that he brought confidential documents into the bathroom, which I thought was really ridiculous. If my staff do this, I may also give him bonuses, after all, it means he is working hard. Looking back on these things, although it was under a lot of pressure at the time, it really seemed a bit funny now.

Just five days before I was jailed, Elizabeth Warren also announced a "war" against cryptocurrencies in an open letter. If I hadn't been under such a lot of pressure at the time, I might have thought these things were quite funny. But looking back now, it is indeed a bit ridiculous.

Farokh: Can you share some of the difficult times you have experienced in prison, such as the living environment in the prison, the feeling of living in a cell with a murderer, and the psychological changes in the face of fear?

CZ :

Life in prison is really hard. Although I can talk about it with a smile when I recall it now, the feeling at that time was not like this at all. This is not a joke experience, nor is it fun to say. I don't want anyone to go through something like this. Although I always think that I have strong pressure tolerance and a calm personality, it is still very difficult to bear in that environment. I went through body searches, being locked in a cell, and my first experience living in the same cell with a double murderer.

In prison, the staff don't care who you are, to them, you're just another prisoner. I was not treated very well. I was told that I could be monitored in prison and that was probably the only difference. But the other prisoners and guards didn't know who I was, they were just doing their jobs.

My roommate is a man who was sentenced to 30 years for double murder. Because of his good performance, he was transferred to a low-security prison after serving 12 years of prison, which is the lowest level he can go to. Prisoners in prison are usually grouped by race. I shared a cell with a Native American and we got along pretty well. But even so, the moment I first entered prison still made me feel very scared. After entering prison, you must first go through a series of inspections, including taking photos, answering questions, and body searching. Then, I was taken to the prison area. When I first walked into the prison area, I saw a three-story building with two rows of cells standing opposite each other with 240 prisoners inside. Everyone was making noises, and many people were covered with tattoos, looking very fierce. At that moment, I thought to myself, this place is not fun.

The guard told me that my cell was on the fifth floor. I walked over and tried to open the door, but found that the door was locked. Later, a strong man came over and told me that the door needed a guard to open. Everyone was watching me, the new prisoner, and it felt very stressed.

Interestingly, although these prisoners seem fierce, they are actually very polite and friendly. I have not had any conflicts with prisoners or guards in prisoners. However, the most difficult thing is psychological pressure. I've been worried that they might just find a reason to stay for a few more months or even add some more charges. This kind of thing has happened to many prisoners, like the "California Hotel", you can check in, but you can never leave.

If someone explicitly tells me "you only need to stay for four months", I'll feel like "Okay, no problem, I can get through it." But in prison, the uncertainty of many things makes me feel very anxious. Even though I was later sent to Halfway House, in the last month, I was arrested by the Immigration Bureau on the grounds that my visa had expired. Although we had applied for a visa extension, we were rejected and I was forced to stay in the United States.

After a few days in the detention center, my lawyer successfully revoked the detention order, but they did not get me back to the halfway home. I have described these experiences in detail in the book.

About SBF (Sam Bankman-Fried)

Farokh: What do you think of SBF (Sam Bankman-Fried) now? He is still serving his sentence. After your own prison experience, have you gained more understanding or sympathy for him?

CZ :

I don't want to make more comments on whether it is fair or not. I don't want anyone to go through prison life, it's definitely not an easy experience. But I also think that any behavior involving fraud, lying and deception must be stopped. This behavior should not exist. However, the sentence in the United States is indeed relatively long, but there is also a mechanism for commutation of sentences. For example, if you perform well, you can get 10 days of sentence every 30 days, so most people actually serve about two-thirds of the sentence. Even so, I still have sympathy for everyone in prison because that experience was really hard.

In prison, I see a lot of people who are sentenced to 10 years and their lives are almost completely fixed. They no longer consider self-transformation. Although most people know what they have done wrong, many people lose the opportunity to correct themselves because of excessive punishment. They just live their lives step by step. Without real corrections, the meaning of imprisonment will be weakened.

And this excessive punishment will waste a lot of taxpayers' money. I don’t know what the most effective correction is, but if you really want people to change, you should let them learn from their mistakes and start over. So, I don't want to give a clear opinion on the length of the sentence or whether it is fair.

As long as we continue to push the industry forward, this is the most important thing. But it is undeniable that the SBF incident has had a very negative impact on the entire crypto industry, leaving our entire field shrouded in a shadow.

Trump and $TRUMP

Farokh: You mentioned Donald Trump a few times. Apparently, you witnessed his rise in prison, does that make you feel more optimistic about your sentence? After all, you mentioned concerns about long sentences.

CZ :

Yes. He was charged with 34 counts at the time, and both the judge and the jury were found to be established, which made me feel very incredible. Later, he announced his campaign for president, and I thought to myself, this might be a good thing. Then he began to publicly support cryptocurrency, and it can be seen that his support is serious, not just talk.

So I think this is a positive signal for the crypto industry and it also brings some hope to those who may be accused of unfairly. When I was following these news in prison, I felt that our industry was lucky because the then US president was supportive of cryptocurrencies and he was indeed a very smart person.

Farokh: I know a lot of crypto founders will fight for support through lobbying, such as getting exposure opportunities through donations. I remember at a digital summit, I got a White House pass to cover the crypto industry. At that time, I also saw many founders of centralized exchanges appear there. So I wonder, do you have similar contacts?

CZ :

No. As a foreign company and a foreign citizen, we cannot contribute to any political activity. This is stipulated by law, and I am very cautious about it and will never involve anything related to the election.

I am still the major shareholder of Binance. So neither the company nor me personally will participate in any election-related activities. I am very careful to avoid touching these sensitive areas. As for the fact that we did not carry out new activities in the United States after I was released from prison. Binance The U.S. is still operating normally, but there is no other action. There have been some previous news reports that I tried to trade Binance U.S. equity for pardon, which is totally false. I have never discussed Binance's equity issue with anyone, and its equity structure has not changed. So, these reports are purely fiction.

Farokh: Is there any progress on your application for presidential amnesty?

CZ :

We hope to convey the truth through some appropriate news reports, such as contacting professionals like Ryan to ensure that the information is accurate. If I could get an amnesty, I believe this would be a positive signal for the industry as a whole. However, now we can only wait and see.

Farokh: Arthur has successfully received an amnesty. Of course, I hope you can apply successfully. I think this is completely possible, I know you are eligible to apply.

CZ :

Yes, I believe the team will support me, which I am very grateful. After all, everyone is working hard for the development of the industry.

Farokh: Do you know all the legal procedures for applying for?

CZ :

Yes, I have already entrusted an attorney to deal with this matter. In fact, it was after Bloomberg published a relevant report that we decided to submit our application formally. At that time, I thought that since the report has been released, it is better to go with the flow. Arthur's application for amnesty was also quickly approved. So we submitted the application about two weeks ago and now we can only wait for the results.

Farokh: How do you evaluate President Trump’s current performance in administration? Do you think the trade war between the United States and China may end?

CZ :

I think President Trump has performed very well, he understands business operations very well. While many people are concerned about policies such as tariffs, I think it is more of a negotiation strategy than a traditional geopolitical game. In business negotiations, a high price is usually offered first, and then gradually concessions are made through negotiations, and finally a balance point that both parties can accept. Although this approach has a great short-term impact on the industry and the economy, it is also refreshing to some extent. President Trump is good at making deals and I believe he will eventually make a deal.

Farokh: So do you think the trade war between the United States and China will end sooner?

CZ :

I think it's possible. The Chinese negotiators are very smart and they are clear about their goals and strategies. However, I think China may not agree with President Trump's negotiation style. Asian culture usually pays great attention to "face", and if you make too tough demands on publicly, it may cause disgust.

This does reflect cultural differences. In the United States, especially under President Trump, he often broadcasts meetings on social media, and this transparency is not common among other political leaders. This style is very special.

However, I believe that both parties have excellent teams of consultants who have a deep understanding of each other’s cultural differences. So I am still very confident about the prospects of the negotiations. At least now the two sides have sat down to talk, rather than completely severing the connection as before. Before, it was more of a contest of soft power, but now the two sides have started to communicate directly, which makes me optimistic about the future.

Farokh: What do you think of TRUMP C oin?

CZ :

I don't know much about it because the statements I hear are very inconsistent. Some say it has a close relationship with Trump, while others say it has nothing to do with it. I haven't studied it in depth myself.

Farokh: But it does have some connection with Trump, right? For example, they plan to hold a dinner on May 22 to invite the top 20 holders to attend.

CZ :

There is some connection, but I am not the top 25 holders of TRUMP Coin.

Farokh: Is it because media reports that make you choose to stay away from it?

CZ :

I try to avoid being involved with these things. The media attention and possible negative coverage made me feel that it wasn’t wise to be involved. So I decided not to buy TRUMP Coin and didn't want to have any connection with it.

Farokh: Do you think the UAE leadership is drawing on Trump’s approach? How do you evaluate their forward-lookingness?

CZ :

The UAE leadership is very forward-looking. They are not only smart, but also visionary and strategic, and are very flexible in dealing with problems. As early as the beginning of the rise of blockchain technology, they realized that oil resources are not a sustainable solution and must expand into other economic fields. In the diversified development, their investment in blockchain and artificial intelligence is particularly outstanding. These are key technologies for the future, and the UAE leadership has a deep understanding of this.

In addition, the relationship between the UAE and the United States is also very harmonious. Although I don’t know the specific details, I heard that they have carried out a lot of cooperation in areas such as artificial intelligence and blockchain. This international cooperation further reflects the openness and forward-looking nature of the UAE.

I think leadership is very important, and a good leader can make the country develop well. I think no matter which system is used, democracy, monarchy, etc., many people may be bound by the system, but what really matters is the leader. Under any system, even democracy will have bad leaders. And where valuable design and strong leaders are, business can flourish. They will strive to find policies without taxes, reasonable regulatory frameworks, etc. I think we saw this here, and we saw it in the United States.

Comparison of DEX vs. CEX

Farokh: Do you think the competitive landscape between centralized exchanges (CEX) and decentralized exchanges (DEX) has changed?

CZ :

There is indeed a change. Many people regard CEX and DEX as opposing poles, but I don’t think this view is accurate. Both are tools for users to access blockchain. Without blockchain, CEX cannot exist. They are just different ways to help users enter the decentralized world. For the average user, logging in with email and password is obviously much easier than managing complex private keys.

CEX and DEX are actually different paths to the same goal. As industry solutions providers, our mission is to provide users with diverse choices rather than relying solely on a certain model. CEX is not the end point, but a bridge that helps users access blockchain.

We have investments in many fields such as CEX, DEX, perpetual contracts and blockchain development. I think the DEX and perpetual contract market has great potential, and is still in its early stages, and there is still much to explore and improve.

However, the current fully transparent trading model may not be suitable for all situations. For example, you can see a large investor placing a short order of $300 million, but in fact, real institutional investors do not want their transactions to be made public. Therefore, the transaction methods of large institutions are often different from those of ordinary users.

Yes, that's true. Traditionally, decentralized transaction pools are often much larger than what we call order books. So I think there is a lot of room for growth here, but I do think the future is decentralized. I have said many times that in the future, decentralized exchanges will be larger than centralized exchanges, and we hope to make a lot of investment in these areas.

Farokh: Have you started to invest?

CZ :

We have invested in multiple DEX and perpetual contract projects. But now I don’t manage these projects directly, we usually only hold a small number of shares.

Farokh: Recently, many people think that if a currency is listed on a centralized exchange, it is a peak signal for it. Now it seems to have become, since it is listed on a centralized exchange, it will lose its popularity as a decentralized exchange. I feel that this view has changed.

CZ :

There is indeed some change, but this is mainly the view of short-term speculators. They regard CEX listing as their last chance, but for real builders, listing is just a starting point, not an end point.

Exchanges exist not only for speculators, but while they provide liquidity, it is more important to create a healthy ecological environment for long-term builders.

Crypto exchange executive group chat event

Farokh: Will you communicate with executives from other exchanges now? The New York Times reported before that you and SBF had some disputes in a group chat with executives, and later we also learned what happened next. Can you share some details about that group chat? Do you still communicate frequently now?

CZ :

I would chat with them occasionally, but not often. First of all, we are all very busy; secondly, there is also a certain competitive relationship between exchanges. There are about 10 founders of that group chat, and it does exist. In fact, this group chat was created when Luna collapsed. At the time, they planned to launch Luna 2, with a guy from FTX who had worked at Bitfinex and OKX before and was very familiar with the situation in the industry.

The original intention of group chat is to coordinate the naming of Luna and Luna 2. If each exchange is named in its own way, it may confuse users. For example, one exchange is called Luna 2, and another exchange is called Luna, but it is actually the same token, which will make users confused. So, we created this group chat to name it uniformly. The name of the group chat is "exchange coordination".

This group chat was created by one person who invited some people to join. Later, I was asked a lot of questions by regulators and the Ministry of Justice because of this group chat. They doubt whether we are manipulating the market, but in fact we are just a temporary collaboration between our peers. In some special circumstances, such as when an exchange is hacked, we will coordinate in the group to track the flow of funds to see if the relevant addresses can be frozen. At this time, exchanges will cooperate.

However, this group chat is mainly used by the founder. We will not track blockchain transactions in person, which is the job of other teams. Later, during the FTX crash, there were rumors that they were trying to dean the USDT. Paolo (founder of Tether) sent a message in the group asking for the cessation of this behavior. I also expressed support and promised to help protect the industry from further blows. Although this news has attracted a lot of attention, there is no problem in the actual situation.

I only met Paolo for the first time recently, and before we were just talking online. He is a great person. People in our industry know each other, for example, once bad funds flowed through Binance, we needed to freeze USDT. I contacted Paolo and he responded quickly and arranged for the team to handle it. We always work very well where we need to work together.

And there is no direct competition between Tether and us. We usually meet at industry conferences, and this is my first time with Paolo and some others. Although we have worked in this industry for 11 years, most of the previous interactions were online.

Are you considering a return?

Farokh: It reminds me of my experiences with my friends. We worked in the cryptocurrency field for a year and a half, but we never met each other until we really met. I appreciate Paolo’s work at Tether, and they have achieved a lot in the United States lately. So, if there is a chance to get you back to Binance, will you lead the company again?

CZ :

I don't think it's possible. I think that experience is a past tense. It is actually a blessing to be "forced to retire". If I had retired voluntarily, someone might think, "Is he unable to do it?"

Farokh: I heard you are a workaholic?

CZ :

That's true. I work at least six days a week, sometimes even six and a half days. Even on weekends, I will arrange meetings. Even if I am not working, I always think about work-related things in my mind. This is probably my way of thinking. Of course, I also tried some extracurricular activities, such as learning kite surfing recently - although I can jump up, my skills in landing are not very good. But by most people's standards, I'm indeed a workaholic. So, I don't think I'll be back at Binance as CEO. In the past year and a half, the company has operated very well without my direct participation. I am still a shareholder of the company and I will benefit from it. And Binance has a very strong team, and our goal is to continue to cultivate and strengthen this team, but I don’t plan to take the helm of Binance again.

Farokh: This sounds interesting. So would you consider starting or joining other encryption projects? If so, what kind of project would you choose?

CZ :

I tend to play the role of a mentor, coach or supporter, like a coach who cheers for new entrepreneurs on the sidelines. I don't plan to lead a new project. Although I still work hard now, my work pace has become much easier than when I was leading Binance back then. I don’t think I need to prove anything if I have to bear that high-intensity responsibility and pressure again. As an entrepreneur, I have achieved enough results and my current state is satisfying.

Quick question and answer:

Farokh: Finally, let’s play a small game, five quick questions and answers. I mentioned before that we created a prediction market platform called Myriad Markets, which is fun to play and full of gamified design. Next I will ask you a few questions, you only need to give a number or a prediction.

What do you think will be the total market value of the cryptocurrency market by the end of the year?

CZ :

About $5 trillion.

Farokh: What is the highest price of Bitcoin in this cycle?

CZ :

I guess it might be between $500,000 and $1 million.

Farokh : Do you think Trump will surpass Doge in this cycle?

CZ :

This is hard to say, it depends on many factors.

Farokh : Will Fart c oin rise to $10? Now it 's priced at $1.20.

CZ :

Then I don't think it's possible.

Farokh : One last question, will you have another dog?

CZ :

Not in the short term. Raising a dog requires a lot of effort.